http://www.metroteenaids.org

Oh and we should stop claiming folks die of lupus, cancer, etc…when we know it's AIDS related.

We will just have to agree to disagree regarding the church.

As far as my perspective goes I think the biggest reason for the
increase is the numbers of black men being recycled through the prison
system. I do think the so called down low thing plays a role, too.
However, I think people took that and ran with it. JL King wrote a book
about it and everyone went crazy. While is important to look at I still
think the number of black men who are 'on the down low' is miniscule
when compared to the number of brothers being locked up.

Growing up in one of LA's gang neighborhoods I know a lot of people who
have been in and out of prison. From the stories I have heard I am
convinced consensual sex and forced sex between men is the NORM in
prison, not the exception. An older brother I know confided in me and
told me his story of what happened to him while being locked down. He
was violated repeatedly against his will. It was heart breaking. Often
these men are ashamed of their experiences and never address being
violated.

One of the articles pointed out that the rate of HIV infections in
prison is higher than the outside population. When you add to the fact
that so many black men are rotating in and out of prison it is not
surprising we have an epidemic on our hands.

I won't even get into the down low thing because that has been beaten to
death.

So what can we do? First off we have to do more to keep our young men
out of incarceration. I know, that is a whole thread in and of itself.
We have to acknowledge that many of them have been violated. We have to
change the tenor of our conversations as black folk to make people feel
comfortable talking about their experiences. We must also address the
rarely talked about rate of depression in our community. But that is
another issue.

Churches can help with opening up dialogue. But remember, younger blacks
are not going to church the way our grandmothers did. And it is the
younger one that are most at risk.

I do not disagree that some churches could do more to educate. And
that's all they can do. They can not make people act differently.
However, I do not think is their responsibility to tackle the problem
head on. There are a host of issues in the black community.
Unfortunately, this is just one of many. And there are churches that do
address this one. Some address violence. Many others address poverty. So
are trying to address the high out of wedlock births. Each church only
has so many resources they can devote to any given issue. Most black
churches are not doing it like TD Jakes and Creflo Dollar. They are
small ministries trying to address the needs of their people.

As far as other cultures go, the entire Middle East is largely religious
and do not share our 'liberal' views on homosexuality. In fact, in Saudi
Arabia homosexual acts are considered criminal under Sharia (Islamic
Law). The president of Iran went as far as to tell a group of students
at Columbia University that Iran does not have any homosexuals. It is
one thing to acknowledge and disagree. Many in that part of the world
will not even acknowledge that Gay people do exist. Remember Islam is
the fastest growing religion in the world. Also, in both China and India
homosexuality in general is frowned upon. And these two countries
represent the fast growing economies in the world. The areas of the
world represent growing cultural and global influence. So their
positions are not insignificant.

Lastly, I was not my intent to refer to Craig as delusional. I meant to
say the notion itself was, not him personally. I do not come onto
internet boards to try to offend people.

thanks for your thoughtful response(s). And, I agree on all counts.

:)

http://www.metroteenaids.org

Oh and we should stop claiming folks die of lupus, cancer, etc…when we know it's AIDS related.

We will just have to agree to disagree regarding the church.

As far as my perspective goes I think the biggest reason for the
increase is the numbers of black men being recycled through the prison
system. I do think the so called down low thing plays a role, too.
However, I think people took that and ran with it. JL King wrote a book
about it and everyone went crazy. While is important to look at I still
think the number of black men who are 'on the down low' is miniscule
when compared to the number of brothers being locked up.

Growing up in one of LA's gang neighborhoods I know a lot of people who
have been in and out of prison. From the stories I have heard I am
convinced consensual sex and forced sex between men is the NORM in
prison, not the exception. An older brother I know confided in me and
told me his story of what happened to him while being locked down. He
was violated repeatedly against his will. It was heart breaking. Often
these men are ashamed of their experiences and never address being
violated.

One of the articles pointed out that the rate of HIV infections in
prison is higher than the outside population. When you add to the fact
that so many black men are rotating in and out of prison it is not
surprising we have an epidemic on our hands.

I won't even get into the down low thing because that has been beaten to
death.

So what can we do? First off we have to do more to keep our young men
out of incarceration. I know, that is a whole thread in and of itself.
We have to acknowledge that many of them have been violated. We have to
change the tenor of our conversations as black folk to make people feel
comfortable talking about their experiences. We must also address the
rarely talked about rate of depression in our community. But that is
another issue.

Churches can help with opening up dialogue. But remember, younger blacks
are not going to church the way our grandmothers did. And it is the
younger one that are most at risk.

I do not disagree that some churches could do more to educate. And
that's all they can do. They can not make people act differently.
However, I do not think is their responsibility to tackle the problem
head on. There are a host of issues in the black community.
Unfortunately, this is just one of many. And there are churches that do
address this one. Some address violence. Many others address poverty. So
are trying to address the high out of wedlock births. Each church only
has so many resources they can devote to any given issue. Most black
churches are not doing it like TD Jakes and Creflo Dollar. They are
small ministries trying to address the needs of their people.

As far as other cultures go, the entire Middle East is largely religious
and do not share our 'liberal' views on homosexuality. In fact, in Saudi
Arabia homosexual acts are considered criminal under Sharia (Islamic
Law). The president of Iran went as far as to tell a group of students
at Columbia University that Iran does not have any homosexuals. It is
one thing to acknowledge and disagree. Many in that part of the world
will not even acknowledge that Gay people do exist. Remember Islam is
the fastest growing religion in the world. Also, in both China and India
homosexuality in general is frowned upon. And these two countries
represent the fast growing economies in the world. The areas of the
world represent growing cultural and global influence. So their
positions are not insignificant.

Lastly, I was not my intent to refer to Craig as delusional. I meant to
say the notion itself was, not him personally. I do not come onto
internet boards to try to offend people.

thanks for your thoughtful response(s). And, I agree on all counts.

:)

so much of all of this stuff has to do with the stigma surrounding mental illness. mentally ill people (depression included) act out sexually. sex is one easy, “affordable” way to self-medicate.

:)

“The message about homosexuality is not going anywhere. There is no point in even arguing that one.”

For all blacks have been through, we don't have the luxury to completely write off any of our own..certainly not based on their sexual orientation. The pious routinely embrace criminals while vilifying gays.

Black Christian women are having sex because it's their biological imperative to do so. No amount of preaching will thwart the sex drive. The church can have an effect however, on the whether women & men protect themselves while having sex.

The government doesn't have the same clout with the black community as the church does. And, if Wright's sermons are any indication, the black church may be culpable in instilling distrust of government in it's congregation. In addition, most AA's have a natural distrust of white authoritarian institutions. If preaching can convince us that the government engineered HIV, then preaching can convince us to use condoms.

I sense that blacks speak a different “language” and tune out those public service announcements that are “foreign”. They will listen if it comes from a respected pastor.

So, why don't you tell us what the HIV/Aids problem is from your perspective?

I want to learn…what cultures are hostile to homosexuality that are neither Christian or American?

The church was a mechanism for organizing and for disseminating information for the Civil Rights movement. It could be the same organizing force in the battle against HIV. HIV is as great a threat as institutionalized racism. However, their ideological bent is that virgin marriage and heterosexuality is the cure for all ills. Now, that is naive.

That is my point. Everybody needs to wake the f up and start protecting themselves. This shit is pure propaganda. EVERYONE IS AT RISK AND EVERYONE SHOULD KNOW THEIR STATUS.

From the CDC
Race or Ethnicity Estimated # of AIDS Cases in 2006
Cumulative Estimated # of AIDS Cases, Through 2006*
Est #AIDS Case in 2006 — Est # AIDS Cases through 2006
White, not Hispanic 10,929 394,024
Black, not Hispanic 17,960 409,982
Hispanic 6,907 161,505
Asian/Pacific Islander 519 7,951
American Indian/Ala ska Native 155 3,345

http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/topics/surveillance/basi...

What they don't say in the ads is that the alarm is due to the fact that black women were not on the radar before. And that is mostly due to not being tested. With all of the know your status campaigns in every hood (which is a good thing), the CDC is recenlty finding out that black women are infected at the rate that was uner reported before like 2000. We have not gone buck wild. Everyone just needs to know that their health is everything.

The great prophet, Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. said so eloquently, that on the day of his eulogy “don't mention I have a Nobel Peace Prize…Tell them not to mention that I have three or four hundred other awards…I’d like somebody to mention that day, that Martin Luther King, Jr. tried to love somebody”. He knew.

If the “church” spent more time preaching love instead a fear and judgment, we would all be better off!!!!!

Sorry ya’ll, I had to get that off my chest.

I believe that those issues in a “relatively” small, highly concentrated population of people, like black folks, are the key to the numbers. It is not an abnormal promiscuity (rolling my eyes). It is a numbers game. And we are losing.

But, I still think that the cases are reported differently. i.e. Public health clinics versus private doctors. I could be way off, but do you know?
For example, I know that the abortion numbers are a lie, because private physicians do have to report abortions like the more publicly funded clinics where more black women tend to have those services performed.

I have no problem with you arguing your message. My issue is when folks don't like certain things about certain religions they make it their life's mission to COMPLETELY take out ALL religions. Religion has given us some very ugly things over the years. It has also given us some very wonderful things over the years. The Civil Rights movement was rooted in the black church.

If your mission is to educate and enlighten people about a community they are misunderstanding, then I am totally with you. However, if your goal is to get everyone to agree with homosexuality, then that's delusional. The lack of understanding and acceptance of homosexuality is not all the fault of the church. There are plenty of cultures that are not very accepting of homosexuality that are neither Christian, nor American.

Like Truth Seeker, you should be careful not to attempt to put all the blame on the church, thus naively believing the elimination of the church means the elimination of the problem.

::

There's always a point in arguing prejudice, discrimination, and oppression.

Religion is the origin of homophobia.

Religion is the biggest perpetrator of homophobia.

I will always argue against that whether or not you think the church's message isn't going anywhere.

Neither is mine.