Jack & Jill Politics

i dint watch it
had no desire
My problem is that Our America aint black or white – it’s green besides I don’t listen to talking heads, folk here don’t get down like that I say work hard and don’t complain

While I can understand the criticisms the first two hours of the series, there is no doubt in my mind that the second two hours ("The Black Man") was much better. Its worst mistake was that the individual profiles were almost too good, and you wanted to see more of their stories.

I never had any notions that Black In America was going to provide much in the way of in depth discussion nor solutions. And while they didn't, I still think the effort was worth it , even while noting that the doc was mostly a summer ratings grab.

If you disagree, look at it this way: At least it wasn't "We Got to Do Better".

I too am over this documentary trying to act like Black folks view everything positive and productive as being white. When I did well in school, I was called a nerd or corny - no one accused me of trying to be White.

The school superintendent and his sons annoyed me because they seemed to buy into that White is right mentality. He wanted a family like the ones he saw on The Andy Griffith Show and My Three Sons? What, did he never see any Black families in real life that he could have emulated?

Thanks for this comment, I agree. It is not intelligence that is derided it's the idea that being intelligent or educated brings you closer to whiteness. Another self-hate issue.

I too was irritated by the Superintendent. Many blacks believe they have to exclude themselves from other blacks to be respected for their achievements. But as I said upthread, we will always be suspect. There are a lot of blacks who are pretending for we are all but a generation or two (and sometimes not at all) removed from the problems deemed specific to blacks.

Morning~

I still didn't watch BIA. And from the tone of the posts last night, I didn't miss much. I'll say it again; the only reason that CNN--or any other mainstream media outlet--would spotlight Black people, is because there's a perception and expectation of dysfunction. And we all know that dysfunction outsells ordinary achievment ...

every day of the week.

You know they trot out this crap every few years to tell all of us what we're like. When they do a Latino, Asian, Arab, Muslim, Jewish et al in America and produce it by someone not from the group it's supposed to represent and claim it as legitimate then I'll put up with this. What they need to be doing is a special on how Black people are envied, our culture is hijacked, how fascinated they are by our fabulousness but want to deny it.

Yeah that would be really good. It would be way more informative to me to also know what different Black people think about other Black people. Like what men think about women, what teens think about their elders, what professionals think of blue collar workers, what students think about drop-outs etc. I think the whole special would have been better if it was about Black peoples opinions and attitudes rather than census items and statistics.

H&F: Co-signing!!! Well said - . . .and produce it by someone not from the group it's suppose to represent and claim it as legitimate. . ." That's the point that I have been trying to tease out - B4 I so gingerly stepped into a very humorous "BOARD ROOM MEETING" and thought that it was reality. :>) :>) [I think that I'm over it. :>)] But it is IMPORTANT to KNOW, WHO designed this production in order to be convinced of its AUTHENTICITY!!!
Thanks for your verbage! :>)
Oh, and CO-SIGN on the NV piece too. Ever notice how many "others" are wearing FUBU? :>) :>)

"a special on how Black people are envied, our culture is hijacked, how fascinated they are by our fabulousness but want to deny it."

Now THAT would be interesting

This b...h Tara is really pissing me off - the judicial system is fair? What f*(&g system is she talking about. Lawd where is her mama - she knows better than this bullshit.

Tara's got to represent....in case she starts sounding like a Democrat.

She seems like a young woman. Immature might be a better word.

The system is fair to those who have the complexion for the protection. Tara knows this, that's why she said what she did. What a Heifer.

I don't know why I even turned that mess on, but there she was, car wreck that she is, and I couldn't turn away.

She's unbelievable - just unbelievable.

msmartin: I am so-cosigning and I didn't get to watch this evening! But I was TOO THROUGH with her yesterday - dissing brothers by stating that they lack the income and educational levels necessary to attract educated Black females[basically, such as herself]. And she had ATTITUDE when she said it!

She must be single and lonely. Or like old white men. Its gotta be one of the two.

dmtyus311: I'm going to make a little trek to Wikipedia and to google and check her out.

I didn't have the stomach to watch Part 2 - I was too p.o'd from watching last night's foolishness.

Shame is a great motivator?

For what?

Addiction?

I don't even think it motivates the addicted.

I think tonight's show was MUCH better than yesterdays. They should have just mixed up all of the segments from yesterday and today instead of separating them into The Black Woman and Family and Black Men because there was so much overlap. I think that they presented less on exclusively Black women problems and successes. I think this one was better because atleast twice they refered to research that shows that the justice system is biased, employers are biased etc. They needed to do that way more with the first episode. I'm glad they discussed racism instead of acting like White people have no effect on us and don't actually have a role in things. I thought the part about rap was good because they admitted that the white executives have a role in degrading hip hop and that it actually had positive roots. It bugs me though that the young Black couples shown were not together (that guy who was late for the birthday party) and the other young guy was dating a White girl. They didn't say anything about how successful Black men sometimes choose White girls or about why they date interracially way more than Black women.
They also didn't say anything about Black racial identity development, like how people feel about being Black, when they realized they were Black and the barriers that would come with it, their thoughts about Africa, or anything about activism or civil rights groups. I think that coving those issues would actually tell the world a lot more about what its like to be Black in Black people's minds. Those issues would be more about the "essence" of being Black. They did a better job but I think the issues I mentioned are so important and they would be totally different from anything White people experience. It might be groundbreaking to White people but definitely not for me.

"They also didn't say anything about Black racial identity development, like how people feel about being Black, when they realized they were Black and the barriers that would come with it"


The title "Black in America" in my mind, suggests that that is exactly what they were going to do - they failed.

I agree. I definitely enjoyed this show much ebtter than last nights. I think there was a better variety of stories and showed more than deadbeat dads, and Spike and Lupe are just wonderful, so I loved that. I'm so tired of the black people "acting white" argument though. The only times I was ever called white was because of the music I listened to (still not cool, but not the same as being called white for being smart), not my intelligence. Buddy from the Cosby show seriously needed to shut up. When he was talking during the Spike segment I just wanted to ask him if he knew how much of an idiot he sounded. Now, my dad is a black republican, but he doesn't try to make as many excuses for white people and just society in general, as this Cosby dude did. Ugh.

Anyways, Much more pleased tonight, but still a lot of things that could have been done better.

Wait. Did Michael Eric Dyson just excuse criminality by blaming POVERTY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks Mike.

Prisons are built based upon the literacy rates of third graders.
Poverty is a factor in literacy rates. So that link can be made.
That is how it is predicted that 1 in 3 black males will wind up
in prison.

The two most common denominators of the Male Prison Population are:
Fatherlessness
Illiteracy

No other common denominator comes close to these two factors.

I'd say untreated mental illness as well, I think I read a stat where many in the prison population have mental illnesses.

Dbn't forget poverty - which is a direct result of the denominators.

I guess then that's also how they determine how many prisons they will build and how many white men from rural America they can keep employed. It's probably also how contracts for communications between prisoners and their families are negotiated with telecommunications corporations who charge them exhorbitant rates. It's a vicious game played on the backs of blacks - poor blacks.

I don't think so. I think he said it's a wonder that poverty hasn't created more criminals. I agree with that.

It's a wonder that poverty has NOT created more criminals.

Oh God, there is still more to this crap. There will be reaction tomorrow morning from Black notables and some participants including the editor of Essence magazine.

I am hoping that after seeing the completed edited version, someone, ANYONE, will let Soledad have it.

Uh oh, Lupe is on. I wub him.

Lupe is cool.

I'm scared...they're talking about rap. I'm scared of them talking about rap....but there is Lupe and I love Lupe.

I love Spike Lee...

Two people - that's an indication of progress?

There's many truths Joseph is not talking about. Who is he - the anti black man?

It seems as though Black Republicans always are.

I just yelled at my tv to make him shut up nowplskthnx

Uh oh, Spike Lee will give them a mouth full!

I curious to know what race women Malcom dates.

you know....you just wanted to see it...lol..

oMG, This guy Malcolm is incrediably talented! I love The Cool Kids & Nicole Atkins!!

Perfect topic now..
The company I work for has 400 employees worldwide, and only 4 black people work for us. Specifically at my job, theres only 3 blacks, and 20 whites.

in my entire career...which has spanned twenty years, i have never, ever worked at a company with anywhere near that ratio. i have, in fact, had much more favorable ratios, but can't reveal exactly where since i'd like to keep my anonymity....but...wow....i'm sorry!

I wish i were making this up.. At the company picnic held in ___________ Va
it felt like a Klan Meeting. It was like being at a scavenger hunt looking for people of color.

Oh finally, the new young black professional.

Did that man just say it's a problem that we've figured out ways for women to raise children without men????

wtf

Black women have not figured out a way to raise children without men, they've figured out how to succeed in spite of circumstances that render them single mothers raising children on their own.

I personally believe a child is better off with two loving parents who want to be that child's parent.

msmartin: AMEN!!

I don't buy it either.

I do. It is not a problem in middle class neighborhoods but I am sure it is true in the inner cities.

I don't buy this thought that if black children do well they're considered white by other blacks.

Unfortunately, it's soooooooo true, I experienced it at the hands of my very own cousins when I was growing up. And couple that with the fact that hip hop glorifies being ignorant and well, there you have it...

That kind of Hip hop is interperting the world, not creating it. It is reflecting the society first. There is a Hip Hop that reflects while it precribes a better way.

Nardwilly,

Please say that again. Hip-hop did not "create anything". Does some hip-hop GLORIFY negative sub-cultures?... Yes. But so does the rest of hollywood.
More importantly, if 80% of hip-hop music is consumed by whites then would not all of these negative situations be reversed? I mean hip-hop is so powerful right? It is the cause of destruction in the black community. So why does it not have the same effect in Japan, middle america, Duke Univ, or anywhere else where it is mass consummed?
Again, you said best, hip-hop is a reflection. Perfect.

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bwsott112@hotmail.com

well take it from a student the better i do in school the "whiter" i become

ggiant,

thats ignorance on the part of your piers . As someone in a worforce thats majority white, I can assure you that there's no denying my race at my job.

well there is one other factor being a black male its not expected of me to excel in school yet a black female its nothing new for her too achieve

I know this is late but, I believe this is leftover from Jim Crow. Men were the primary actors in the economy of those times. Smart men were a threat to white men and would be beta or killed. Women were less of a threat. In order to save the lives of men Black folks sent girls, not boys, to school. There was no value in a smart Black man. A smart Black man was a danger to himself and his family.

The achievement gap for Black men is a complex problem that requires much effort from many people.

Well let me assure you - you are not white to white folks. I too have been derided by other blacks at times for striving to be better than what is expected from us, but I see it for what it is. It's fear. All you can do is stick with your constitution, show those people that they are capable of what you expect from yourself, and, in time, you will gain their respect and inspire them to be better too.

Now that is the truth!

I'll watch it without commercials later. Right now, I'm listening to Les Miz- 10th Anniversary Concert.

OMG that is one of my favorite musicals. I used to play it every day, I love show tunes. Colm was the best Val Jean. It was so cool to see Daphne Rubin Vega play Fantine.

are they going to offer any solutions to theses problems?

Apparently, there were screenings to black audiences all across the country.
These groups are attempting to come up with solutions for implementation.

Nope. That'd be too much like right. (My mama says that all the time)

carolinagirl: Mine too! :>) :>) Allowing these kinds of phrases to stay in our culture really helps to keep us together! Thanks for using it! :>) :>)

So do I.

I got it from my mama.

so then what is the purpose of all this commentary is like their just putting black men on display like we are some different species thats needs to be examed

Because a brotha is about to become president and CNN still wants access on the Beltway Cocktail Weenie circuit.

I believe so. I wonder how many black people have suffered unknowingly because of anger about Obama's ascendancy. I bet he's making them hate us all.

I would like to see a expose on the bigots and racists. Lets go rummaging through their trash for the kiddy porn, the bruises on their wives eyes. Lets see all the nasty, ignorant things they say about black people when they're examined.

Now that would take a few weeks to air.

I don't think that is what they are doing. The solutions are complex as are the problems. Racism will not be solved anytime soon. Hopefully, this
will inspire us to become involved and active in the areas which concern
us.

I agree wholeheartedly.

It is much better today. At least some of the reasons for the black male's problems are being revealed. The issue of racism is finally being brought forth.

Finally.

agreed

Every since I heard about this report "Black in America" I've been thinking hard about what it means and how I feel about being "Black in America" and I have come to the conclusion that being Black in America means that you are suspect. Your character is suspect, your morals are suspect, your abilities are suspect. Even if you have suceeded and achieved, you remain suspect.

What does it mean to the rest of the JJP fam?

FYI for anyone interested who didn't already see the special the whole thing is online at www.dimewars.com

msmartin: SAME!! They called my sister -DR. N-word! :>) :>)

The same damned thing.

Which is why I take exception to Kos calling me out on the lack of diversity at his damned conference. Like I was the only one commenting on that fact, when his own white brethren were complaining about the same damned thing.

Just keep on what you're doing with BAR. We can add the future candidates like Donna Edwards to Act Blue's website for fundraising purposes ourselves. Perhaps there could be a combo conference like Blogging While Brown with UNITY and we'll get the top candidates running with more than 25% POC constituency to attend. We can cross-post on several blogs. Shecodes at Black Women Vote will have an agenda in place. Everybody else will of course be jumping on the bandwagon to co-opt as per usual after the fact but they will not get away with taking any credit. For those that still wish to participate at NetRoots perhaps they will actually listen to suggestions and if not they will start to look intentionally separatist. After 4 years you can't keep claiming ignorance or inability. Of course anyone can attend but why would anyone want to when there are places that are willing to acknowledge their presence and present topics of interest to a wider variety of people. It's never been more profitable for former Republicans to become Democrats. And unless the FCC is fortified there will be jobs for the more idiotic Repug meme chanters to work as they criticize and nit-pick everything President Obama does and does not do.

True That. Because, in the end all Markos wants is REPRESENTATION, not PARTICIPATION from people of color; I don't care what he says - I'm looking at his ACTIONS. Why do we bloggers of color have to be the ones doing outreach to get people of color to Netroots Nation if they are serious about inclusion?

I think Gina Cooper took what we told her, put some major spin on it and went whining to Markos about the complaints that nearly 90% of bloggers I talked to at NN had - THE LACK OF DIVERSITY. Those caucuses don't count because the way they were scheduled, got the intended result - SEPARATION of every ethnicity and gender.

Markos may come from privilage, but Bill O' Reilly lets him know every day on that ragtag show of his that he considers Markos a dirty ethnic blogger - just like the rest of us. It's not our fault that Markos hasn't got the message yet, and wants to be ethnic when convenient, like his buddy, the Dark Sith. He's Black when convenient and goes privilege when there's something on the agenda he wants.

Didn't you know you weren't supposed to say anything? You were to let the parental brethern speak on your pitiful down troddened(sp) behalf.

You may only speak out if you are a kiss ass black conservative speaking in favor of conservatism and blaming blacks for everything that ails them.

Pardon my French, but f*ck all that. I refuse to subject my Blackness to whatever racist whites happen to think it is. I'm not going to give in to that ridiculous racial paranoia that crap like this so-called documentary is peddling.

HOLLA!

That's not the way I feel about myself, I'm very confident and it causes me lots of trouble, but it is the reality of what America thinks of me and you.

Yeah I agree. It means you are suspect, you have might have some sort of learning disability or criminal insanity, or insatiable sexual appetite, or uncontrollable fertility. It means you start out with strikes against you. When you meet a White person they might have a negative expectation of you and you have to prove you are not some sort of unintelligent, criminal, deviant. You have to prove that with every new person you meet. Even with people you know, you have to keep up appearances because as soon as you do something that is stereotypically Black they will think "ah ha, he/she is just like the rest of them".

Exactly. And if you're none of that, you're arrogant.

A white manager once told me, "there's a N@#$%^ in every black person, and you just gotta find it". Maybe that's what a lot of them think.

Exactly. You're never good enough.

We know what happens to kids who grow up feeling like they're never good enough. A black kid may overcome that in their family only to face in from an entire society.

We've seen it with Barack and Michelle Obama; they are as successful as one could hope to be both personally and professionally and yet ........well, you've heard it all.

I resent the fact that Barack and Michelle have to be so perfect. If Barack graduated at the bottom of his class like McCain, they wouldn't stop talking about it.

And that Truthseeker - is a large part of the problem.

"Being Black in America Today is basically equivillant to having a felony conviction."
there words..

OMG, A white woman just told the whole truth and nothing but the truth. A black man without a criminal record is the equivalent of someone white with a felony conviction. She said that's what being Black in America is.

That was a ton of bricks.

So that's why I got stopped "walking while black"...twice...in my neighborhood?

Damn, I feel SO much better!

How did that slip by the editors?

They plan to keep beating you over the head with negative stories until you forget about it.

Wow. Well, at least somebody said it. I chose not to watch the "documentary" tonight. I don't think I would be able to take any more black man bashing.

I was just wondering if anyone had seen Al Giordano's story about the Clintonistas trying to embarrass Barack's sister in Mexico City not long ago?
http://narconews.com/Issue54/article3169.html
Don't throw away those tin foil hats just yet, snakes are still on the prowl.

black republican joseph c phillips who is a friend of lashawn barbers. another black republican blogger...i sure hope seeing him was a one time thing..

Considering that Joseph C. Phillips last real gig was as Denise Huxtable's husband on the Cosby Show should tell you all you need to know about homeboy.

And LaShawn Barber's certifiable...

He's bitter because he was never cast again. Thank goodness.

Back when the Cosby show aired, "jerk" wasn't part of my consciousness vocabulary....but I felt it about this guy...I felt "jerk" in my bones.

I know what you mean.

I was so happy they cut him out of Girlfriends. Ive never got him, TruthSeeker, you hit it, ever since Cosby, Strickly Business, etc.

It's not lol he's on a segment about Spike Lee.

No this is not "groundbreaking" but I do apprechiate that those that are sharing their stories. They may not be sweet and upbeat enough for all of us but it is a reality. They exist too. Though they deserve a better edited documentary than this.

All of america and the world deserved a better documentary than the BIA special presented.
Why did they not balance the the with a segment where they walk through someone's house and point out all of the things that were invented by black people. They could have gone into a segment that explained how important education was to former enslaved people that they built colleges all through the south, midwest and the east coast.
They could have shown all of the successful black communities and entrepenuers. There is so much good that people don't see or discuss.
It could have been more balanced.

Why did they not balance the the with a segment where they walk through someone's house and point out all of the things that were invented by black people.

::

Wouldn't that have been too much like right.

This thing about the crack epidemic is not ground breaking

Its not but it's vital to the analysis of how much of this strife came to be.

Oh, oh!
THE ANGRY BLACK MAN!

Touching first story about what it was like to be in the deep south when MLK was assassinated

Well, the annoying brother with the graphics is back.

Google "Jon Goode". These promos/intros may come off as annoying, but the brother is not.

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I just turned on my tv and saw dude....CNN can't be serious. I mean really?!?

They interviewed him today. He said that a young woman called him and told him of the project, he sent in a dvd of his work, they liked it, and he got the gig.

I don't think it fits, but maybe that's the producer's fault in not giving more guidance.

Well, I take comfort in the fact he got a gig.

Why'd they get Campbell Brown to do these previews anyway? It's clear that for her inquiries, she's relying on notes instead of actual knowledge. The discussion can be awkward enough and she turns it up a notch.

Because having someone with some ACTUAL knowledge of the Black community and its complexity.....

well, you draw your own conclusions.

if the Campbell Brown preview is any indication, Its gonna be alot worse tonight...Brandon is late for his babies birthday party, and is pretty much a deadbeat.
Apparently that runs in his family though..ugh....