Jack & Jill Politics

Teacher-


My friend Sara is from Honduras, black latinos have a lot of problems in their countries, trust me. Her family is ashamed of him she told me. My grandmother is from Cuba, she fled to Jamaica. Go look up how they are treated and what goes on.



The history is very deep and I am suprised that most people do not seem to know nor understand it.



The problem is that too many are in denial. PERIOD. Most people who see it are those who are effected by it. Many black latinos, like many black Americans just dont get it.



You see Brazil is not a hispanic country but look at their caste system from what I have read, they had something close to an apartheid there, so imagine.



I know for example in Jamaica when my mother was growing up, their were many white, chinese, syrian and other non-black Jamaicans who controlled much of the wealth and locked out many black Jamaicans from certain facets of life. My mother got threw cause they considered her mother to be "mulatto" (she's simply a black Cuban) and her father was half Indian. She told me about a lot of the issues that went on and when much of that broke down, many of the non-blacks left the country. Its so interesting when I discuss this with people, they have no idea of the complexity of these countries when it comes to race. That's colonialism and the history of white supremacy for you.



As for the dolls thing you spoke about yea, black children are still failing it.If people continue to deny the existence of certain issues and the root causes, nobody will move past it. It will continue to manifest with each generation.

I'm not sure that Hillary can even get personal redemption for/from herself, much less black people.


For one, she'd have to admit she was wrong, and she can't do that. She WON'T do that. Her whole campaign is a testament to that. It's always somebody else's fault:



Black people voting for Obama? It's because black folk are "caught up in the concept."



Obama doing well? It's because he's black.



Not having a plan (or money) after Super Tuesday? It's because people are sexist and racist.



Not paying your bills? It's because the firm I hired to pay the bills isn't paying the bills.



Losing even MORE black support because of race baiting statements made by surrogates? That's because Obama played the race card.



One of your most loyal superdelegates crossed over to the other side? That's because he's a Judas.



Losing NC big time? Well, that's because NC has all those blacks.



Winning IN by a hair? Well that's only because Gary, IN was being shady with the vote?



Not mathematically being able to get the nomination? It's all because of the blacks and the eggheads.



Nothing is ever her fault, or her campaign's fault. And until she admits those faults, she'll not get any redemption for herself, much less blacks.



But in the nearly 20 years she's been on the scene, nothing has ever been her or Bill's fault. It's always Paula Jones' fault or Gennifer Flowers' fault or the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy's fault.



Power has totally corrupted this woman, and it's eating her (and Bill) up inside that a no-name beginner stole her shine. I think Obama winning over her hurts 100x more than if Richardson or Edwards or Kucinich (lol) won over her, because they arrogantly assumed that people would not vote for the skinny black guy with a funny name.

truthseeker, no offense taken.


That 911 episode happened back in February, if I heard the report correctly. It's a special report 3 months later? What took so long to get that story out?



From where I sit, there's a concerted effort to bring racism front and center so the nation can see how racist we are, suggesting that Barack has no chance to be elected.



That's the message the Clintons are putting out, that's the message the MSM is putting out, and it's all an attempt to divide the nation.



Racism needs to be revealed in all its ugliness. I get that. But right now, it's a political/media strategy to get McCain elected.



It's going to backfire.



::



To the anonymous who spoke of Clinton's redemption with Black people. I wasn't talking about redemption from the perspective of mending relationships with those she has destroyed or tried to destroy. It was more about her chance at personal redemption. I'm not sure she has a soul, though. In which case she wouldn't be interested in personal redemption.

Obama/Hagel 08


Richardson is not strong enough.



McCaskill and Strickland also good choices..



As for webb, Gov. Kaine is a better choice

texas girl,


here's the YouTube vid of the 911 call:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTR05I9-p5k

Friends, I guess hillbilly is in the 4th stage of death (kinda sounds like a martial arts film-smirk). I would also make her an ambassador...to Gilligan's Island. I'd put her on a boat with a map and give her the "call me" sign with the fingers. She is becoming more irrelevant by the minute.


I think O should go to all the places where he isn't popular because he is going to be their president too. To know him is to love him. I always tell students, you don't run from challenges, you run to them (yes, I'm really a teacher).



And when all is said and done, everyone better be glad that O won the presidency instead of Hillbilly. Her 1st act as president would be to deploy troops to Iowa. She'd be telling N & S Carolina, "I hope you like the roads you have, cause you won't be getting any new ones for a loooong time." Poor Bill Richardson's face says it all. I wouldn't be surprised if he held up a sign that said "help me!" during his next interview. I'm sure he knows about the clinton death list, which has way too many people to be coincidental. He might have to hire illegal aliens to start his car for him.



As for Condolezza Rice, I wonder what would make her say "my husband" when she is unmarried/never married? My cousin is totally convinced that she & W are paramours, but I can't see Laura bush putting up with it unless she has her own extra-marital action. Condi might have some fantasy about him, but I can't see him being attracted to her because she is smart.



As for Hispanics, I think we must build alliances with them. I also consider them to be our cousins (genetically). One of my interests is studying African history, which one can find in many places in the world. I'm not really sure why, but many Hispanics I have met have been of African descent. I live in a city with many, many Hispanics, and a whole lot of Black Mexicans. Some will admit they have African heritage & some won't, but it seems like many of them are aware of it.Below is a link with genetic research showing that about 10% of Latin americans have African ancestry.

http://www.ancestrybydna.com/welcome/productsandservices/ancestrybydna/ethnicities/#mexicanhisp

African affiliation in Mexican Hispanics

Mexican Hispanics commonly show African affiliation, presumably as a consequence of the slave-trade importation of Africans to North America, the Caribbean and Latin America.

Underhill et al., 2001 showed that about 10% of the Y-chromosome haplotypes in Latin America are of African origin (see Figure UNDERHILL ). In contrast, the frequency of African haplotypes for North American Native American Amerindian and South American populations was insignificant. Here is a link about the 2nd Pres. of Mexico who had African ancestry and abolished slavery in Mexico.

http://www.frenchcreoles.com/CreoleCulture/famous%20people/vincenteguerrero.htm

There are a few websites devoted to Black Mexicans if you care. I would love to talk about it any time. In central america, the Black people of Honduras, Nicaragua and Belize are called Garifuna. I saw them last summer when we went to Honduras and I also have students at my school representing. Most of my Columbian students have been Black (all but 1), as well as the people I've met from Panama, Venezuela,Cuba, Domican Republic & Puerto Rico.



As a race, we've received the worst PR in the history of humankind. Everyone on the planet has been brainwashed to put us down, including ouurselves. Our children are still saying that Black dolls are ugly compared to white dolls (if you saw the David Wilson documentary recently). Hispanics have not had our experience of Black excellence and Black power. They don't have the audacity to hope that we have. We have to help them be more progressive. I always tell them that they are my people and that we share common ancestry.I speak the language of my colonizer and they speak the language of theirs.

Exactly, I thought it was meant that she was prone to arguing and discourse. I see now that she maliciously divisive.


Oregon should calm some of the hate she stirred in WV and KY.



I read a story about her worshipping at a church in KY today were the sermon was on infidelity and that she did not speak and was not recognized in any special way.

truthseeker,


What was the 911 call about?

ms.martin,


That's Hillary's energy. People kept saying she's divisive, she's divisive. It just went over my head 'cause I couldn't grasp how someone could be intrinsically divisive. This one woman has managed to get an entire nation to choose sides based on race! While Barack is trying to bring people together, she's busy undoing his good work. This is why he has to turn his back on her and everything she stands for.



I know the day after Hillary made her insipid "hard working" statment, it was more likely for a black child anywhere in America to be called "nigger". That cannot be tolerated!



This rally in Portland was a moral victory against Hillary. I hope he blows her away in Oregon, wiping out all gains she made in WV & KY. It will be a symbolic repudiation of her tactics. Racism doesn't pay, Hillary!

Truthseeker


None taken.



I did see the story on CNN about the 911 operator.



When I see stuff like this it makes my sometimes suspicious mind wonder what kind of affect this election is having on everyday folks.



I know it's bringing out the worst in people Pat Buchanan.



Just saying.

Link: http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/05/... going after the media again. Here's Clinton at a KY rally:



"I would bet every single one of those folks, they’ve got a job; we can see that. They’ve got good health care; we know that. They can pay whatever the charge is at the gas pump most likely. They can send their child to college. I’m not running to represent them, I’m running to fight for you and to be your champion."



Yeah. . . because Tim Russert and Chuck Todd can do MATH. That's soooo elitist.



The connection is scary. . . Bush don't like readin' and Hillary don't like math. That's leadership for you.



She also said she's leading in the popular vote, which is not true.



How can anyone look at this person and think she's softening her rhetoric to bring the party together? Unity is the last thing on her mind. She's rallying her base to stir resentment.



And now we've got Hillary supporters planning protests at future Obama events????



Yep. . . sounds like unity to me.

@ craig & msmartin,


no disrespect intended. :)



I think sometimes, ruthlessness is called for.

texas girl said, "I read a comment over at NBC First Read that said that Obama will be holding a rally in Tampa next week and some of Hillary's supporters will be there to "turn backs" in protest; regarding the re-vote.


Weak. Yet entirely consistent with Hillary's passive agressive tone and "woe-is-me" victimology. Secluded in their state of denial. . .Hillaryland. . . where math and pledges aren't important so long as they get between Clinton and her entitlement.



This is the type of stuff that really pisses me off. They know the damn rules. They're not that stupid.



My question for those protesters is this: If they're so self-righteous, then where the hell was their protest when the DNC made it's decision LAST YEAR? As a matter of fact, where was their savior, Hillary Clinton? After all, her boy Harold Ickes played a role and Hillary signed the pledge along with every other candidate. She's on record as saying the state would not count.



This is why Hillary gets no love. She'd rather spread false propoganda than accept defeat. No, instead she wants to blame everything on Obama. Rules are rules. Those two states broke the rules. It's really not that hard to figure out.



Obama played by the rules. He has no obligation to help Hillary bend and break the rules for her favor.



Hillary gave her word and then took it back when she saw she wasn't gonna win.



Her word is useless.

I don't think the Clintons can be redeemed, not by black people anyway. Not in politics, anyway. The only redemption they'll find among black people is with those who looked past all the racebaiting and shrugged it off as them doing what they had to do.


But for most, once you cross that line, you can't cross back.



The only way the Clintons will find redemption among black people is if they get out of politics and start their redemption tour from the outside. But, do you think they care about getting in good with black people unless there's something in it for them?



And, how do you seek redemption from people you obviously don't have a lot of respect for? I can't imagine the Clintons playing this game on "working class whites", or Jews, or women.



You don't play those kind of games with people you have respect for.



I guess the underlying problem with the Clintons is not that they played the race game from top to bottom.



The real problem is they didn't have very much respect for blacks to begin with, and thought we'd just "come around" after she got the nomination that was rightfully hers.



And that's not just a Clinton problem, that's a politician problem because 99% of these politicians, black and white, come 'round our churches the Sunday before Election Day, pander to us, sing Negro spirituals, glad hand and kiss babies. And then after they win, they ignore us until the next election cycle. Hey, it's ok to disrespect black people because they'll keep coming back for more.



Maybe it's the black electorate who needs redemption. We need to get back our power and self-respect. The Clintons would have never played these games against a Jewish candidate because they know they would get the smackdown and would be held accountable. Howard Dean and Nancy Pelosi would have shut Hillary down from jump.



No self respecting Jewish politician would have cosigned Hillary's foolishness whether they were with her or not. The media wouldn't have given her a pass or accepted her word as gospel.



What this election has taught me is that 99% of the people who say they are for black people, including so called "black" leaders, are only out for themselves and we've been punked and played so long that everyone thinks it's ok because "we'll just come around."

Truthseeker


I'm not listening to preachers, I but I have an innate sense about what it right. I'm only sure about God and love.



I also believe that discourse is hard on the soul. I have felt terrible throughtout this process.

OMG,


That picture of Family Obama in Oregon is too precious for words.

I like the idea of Obama/Richardson. But that ticket might have problems uniting the party. I'm not saying it's right, but I could easily see Clinton's base villify and demonize Richardson throughout the entire general election. Camp Clinton appears to have a personal beef with him that seems a little unhealthy.


Well, it was the whole subtext of "How dare this ungrateful Uppity #($* back this Uppity #($*%$."



That's how I took the attacks against Richardson.



They never attacked any White switcher to Obama that way.

Don't know much about Bayh. He's rubbed me the wrong way, but he hasn't been as bad as some of the other Clinton surrogates.



b-serious,



I can tell you why Bayh rubs you the wrong way.



It goes back to the whole ' Obama is an elitist' garbage.



The gall of having someone like Bayh, who got EVERYTHING IN LIFE HANDED TO HIM BECAUSE HE WAS BIRCH'S SON...



To call someone else who WORKED HIS WAY UP FROM THE BOTTOM..



ELITIST..



WELL, it rubs ME the wrong damn way.

That Portland crowd gives me tingles, it's stunning, awe-inspiring and a whole lot of white people


whole lotta White people..



BWA HA HA HA HA HA



the picture is amazing.

Stike Strickland and Bayh


Add Sebelius and the Governor of Montana and Kaine of Virginia

@ Truthseeker: You'll like this picture of the Obamas in Oregon


http://tinyurl.com/6fjwlb

Clintons are playing good cop/bad cop now.


Yawn.



truthseeker, I believe in redemption for its spiritual value, not ts religious value.



I don't go to church.

I read a comment over at NBC First Read that said that Obama will be holding a rally in Tampa next week and some of Hillary's supporters will be there to "turn backs" in protest; regarding the re-vote.


Will the majority of Hillary's supporter's be voting for McCain?



My gosh some of those sites are just evil.

Did you guys see the story of the woman in Nashville who called 911? It's on CNN in a few minutes.

You guy have got to stop listening to preachers about that redemption stuff. Barack tried that once and got burned. Hillary's redemption is on her own time, somewhere in Siberia, maybe an Ambassadorship.


That Portland crowd gives me tingles, it's stunning, awe-inspiring and a whole lot of white people.

Thanks for the pics Craig.


His daughters are there. Can you imagine what is going through there mind?



All those people came out to see their daddy.

teacher- I'm Puerto Rican and my whole family who is in NJ is voting Obama. In fact every Latino I know is voting for Obama (but there are educational, and socioeconomic issues to consider too...)


That said, the issue for many latinos is the same issue for people who are not so into politics... we buy the branding. Like many African American and working class white people who bought the brand. This election, Black people are taking a closer look at the Clintons and can now see that their support is a farce.



Now will Puerto Ricans see past the brand? Maybe, maybe not. Clintons have sold their "love for latinos" for a lot longer than Obama has had time to...



Therefore, let's not over step the lack of support for Obama's campaign than anything other than waker branding.

Val


Love those Yes We Can Air Force Ones - I hope he sent the Senator a pair.

Craig


Love the pics. Isn't that a sea of hard-working white folks as far as the eye can see at an Obama rally.



I don't blame him, I would skip Kentucky for that too; take me where the love is.

B-serious


Great analysis as usual



Craig



I was thinking about that redemption thing today. Mostly, because it's the right thing to do, however, I can't see it.



The Clintons have compounded whatever negative racial stereotypes that society has about the AA race and without consideration for a community that has been so loyal to them and without regard for the pain they could/would cause and they "didn't even bat an eye"!



I don't know how I'm ever going to get there.

Yes, it was texas girl.


And here are some more



Photos and a Slideshow



Great pictures.

Craig,


ok...the "in their Gucci shoes" is hilarious.



Is that part of his speech in OR?

Loved this quote:


He added a few lines to an otherwise typical stump speech, attacking presumptive GOP nominee John McCain for his ties to lobbyists, an issue the campaign is pushing and one the candidate spoke about with reporters earlier in the day. "John McCain now has had to get rid of five of his top advisers because it turns out they’re all lobbying, many of them for foreign governments. That’s because he practices the same kind of politics that we’ve grown accustomed to in Washington," he said, adding that his campaign did not take money from PACs or federal lobbyists and saying he would have meetings on C-SPAN rather behind closed doors with lobbyists "in their Gucci shoes."



Seems Obama is going to turn the elitist label back on McCain.

I'ma wait for Gore to tell me that. ;)

Yea, Gore would not want to deal with that as good as it sounds.

@rikyrah,


Thanks for the compliment.



@craig,



First, that's one beautiful picture.



Second, Obama/Gore is an interesting ticket. But I'd guess Gore has no intentions of being anyone else's veep ever again. I think 8 years with the Clintons scarred him pretty bad.

Oh, yeah. I do believe in redemption. Even for the Clintons.


An Obama/Gore ticket would give the Clintons an opportunity to redeem themselves if they were to do everything in their power to make sure that ticket got elected.



Just saying.

rhondacoca said, "The point is yes, the Clintons race baited but her and her campaign did not create some of the problems that they crudely exploited for political gain."


I agree. And that's one of my major beefs with the Clintons. Because, to me, that's just as bad as creating the problem themselves.



How cynical. . .



How divisive . . .



And the thing that gets me is one would think that the first serious female candidate would be careful not to play such a game.



Again. . . It would have been soooo easy to marginalize Hillary as the "female" candidate; to play on the sexist fears of a woman in charge; to site polling data showing the country's reluctance to vote for a female president and spin that into an electability argument. . .



But Obama didn't do that. It's called integrity. . . the Clintons have shown that they have none.

craig,


DAMN!

Obama/Gore 2008


It's a way back and forward at the same time.

For anyone who questions Barack's electability, just send them to this picture:


Record 75,000 at rally in Portland, Oregon

@inkognegro


I wouldn't mind Wesley Clark if the party forced Obama to choose a former Clinton surrogate to heal the party. As far as I know, he played it straight down the middle by sticking to pro-Hillary arguments rather than anti-Obama spin. The problem, however, is that he doesn't deliver a state for the general election.



Rendell would be a strategic choice for PA and "unity. . . BUT, as I just implied, I'd have a big problem getting past his race-baiting in early March.



Ted Strickland would also be a strategic choice for the same reasons as Rendell. But, whenever I hear his name, all I can think of is that sheepish look he had, nodding in approval, as he watched Hillary yell, "SHAME ON YOU, BARACK OBAMA." I can't get that image out of my head.



Don't know much about Bayh. He's rubbed me the wrong way, but he hasn't been as bad as some of the other Clinton surrogates.



Right now, I do like the sound of:



Obama/Richardson

Obama/Biden

Obama/Sebelius

Obama/Webb



I'd narrow that list down to Obama/Biden, Obama/Webb and Obama/Sebelius.



I like the idea of Obama/Richardson. But that ticket might have problems uniting the party. I'm not saying it's right, but I could easily see Clinton's base villify and demonize Richardson throughout the entire general election. Camp Clinton appears to have a personal beef with him that seems a little unhealthy.

B-Serious,well said. I still do not understand why people think that the Clintons did not race-bait.


However from reading a lot of black blogs, I find that too many do not understand the very issues that exist amongst their Latino counterparts. The issue between blacks and Latinos is real however it was exploited by the media and the Clintons for political gain and race-baiting.



Mabye I know that its real because I grew up in the Bronx in a most Hispanic neighborhood and attended a catholic church with mostly Latinos, Irish and Italians. Where do some of you live?



The point is yes, the Clintons race baited but her and her campaign did not create some of the problems that they crudely exploited for political gain.



I am for unity but I deal with reality.

scratch Strickland & Bayh.

Some interesting estimates:


75,000 people turn out for today's Portland rally



57,000 turn out for the Pope's appearance at Yankee Stadium



35,000 turn out at Kerry's Portland rally in 2004

My cursory short list for VP


Gov. Strickland of OH

Wesley Clark

Gov Richardson of NM

Sen Webb of VA

Sen Bayh of IN

Sen McCaskill of MO





Additions? Subtractions? Thoughts?

b-serious,


you rock.



And, you speak the truth.



The Go-spel truth.

Clinton's entire message to the super delegates is that the black guy can't win. And she plays off of racist sentiment to proclaim her electability as the safer more familiar choice in a country hostile to change.


It was Clinton's camp that said Latinos wouldn't support a black candidate back in January.



It was Clinton's camp (via Ed Rendell) that started the whole "whites won't vote for Obama" meme back in early March.



It was Clinton's camp (via Geraldine Ferraro) that started the whole "affirmative action candidate" meme back in early march.



It was Clinton, herself, who came out and said Obama can't win white votes in her interview with USA Today a couple of weeks ago.



That's called injecting race into the campaign. . . hiding behind polling data to ask that the Democratic party placate bigoted negative voting patterns in the name of "smart politics."



Mind you, Obama hasn't sought to exploit similarly hostile sentiments based on gender. Although he could have taken the same approach under the guise of "shrewd politics."



Yes. . . . the Clintons have played the race card. It has been a central theme of Hillary's campaign. It's their passive aggressive attempt at a self-fulfilling prophesy. . . say it long enough and the people do what they're told.



Some people vote for the Clintons because that's what they think they're supposed to do. She is the default candidate for a lot of low-information voters. Couple that with her high regard (up until now) within the Democratic party and you've got a lot of people who are pre-programmed to to trust what they hear and do as they're told. They're pre-programmed to give Hillary a pass and excuse her actions. They're pre-programmed by the same partisan political warfare that makes a rank-and-file Republican defend everything that comes out of Bush's mouth.



It has nothing to do with getting things done for the people, but everything to do with choosing sides and protecting the captain at all costs.



I've heard far too many Hillary supporters argue, "it's her turn" or "it's payback time." That's what this is to some people. It's payback for 8 years of Bush. . . it's payback for 20 years of the "vast right-wing conspiracy." It's focused on the personal politics of Clinton rather than the party politics of the Democratic party or the noble politics of elected officials (Republican, Democrat or Independent) who just want to get stuff done regardless of who's up and who's down.



So we excuse the race-baiting from Hillary when we KNOW that a lot of those CBC negroes would be the first to march on Washington if the same thing were said by a Republican. Why? Because it's our team this time, that's why.



Obama's not perfect, but he has given the Democratic Party a choice when it comes to picking the type of party the Dems want to be going forward.



Obama has not made Hillary's gender a central focus of this campaign as Hillary's done with Obama's race.



What if Obama came out and said, "You know, we've got a lot of polling data that says this country isn't ready for a female president." What if Obama preyed on this nation's sexism the way Hillary's preyed on this nation's racism?



Ironically enough, Hillary also shamelessly plays her gender card every chance she gets.



Now, what would happen if Obama, himself, came out and blamed everything on the white man? What would happen if the NAACP characterized every pro-hillary endorsement as a "betrayal" of the black community? He'd have been kicked out of the race so fast it would make your head spin.



Yet Hillary said the "all-boys-club" ganged up on her when she tanked a debate in Philadelphia last fall. The NY chapter of N.O.W. likens Hillary's obstacles to a "gangbang," and calls the pro-Obama endorsement by Ted Kennedy a "betrayal" of all women. Just as some of her supporters claimed "betrayal" when NARAL had the audacity to endorse Obama last week.



The word "betrayal" implies entitlement.



And the Democratic Party will never find it's spine if it can't break that "entitlement" and find a way to make a clean break from the Clintons and they're self-serving game of plurality politics.

Portland Oregon live Obama Rally:


Barack Begins 5:30

"And why does the corporate media seek to lump all Latinos together as a monolithic group?"


I agree. A guy the other night on MSNBC made a rud comment about tacos. However when it comes to prejudice- it is different. My roomate who is Afro-Cuban talks alot about this. Also, about a year ago, I read an article in the New York Post.



http://www.nypost.com/seven/02152007/tempo/black_pride_tempo_tego_calderon.htm



It was with Reggaeton artist, Tego Calderon, I wasn't suprised by it since I know about it. However many that I have shared it with were suprised. READ IT.





When my aunt got married to a Puerto Rican guy, none of his family showed up. It was like a sit out protest and it was horrible. I was 11. I also had many friends growing up and even now who say some horrible things.



For example, my roommate (Columbian) refuses to vote for Obama because he does not look like a president. She says she cannot trust him and she had (sit down for this one) the audacity to say that blacks were going to take over and crime will rise if he becomes president. Crazy right. I actually have been trying to get her out of the apartment for her blatant racism.



The prejudice is not widespread and I have met many Hispanics who at least on the surface don't feel that way, especially younger ones. I have faith.

Craig,


It is impossible to separate the two. While they are different people and have different personalities, for political purposes, they are one and the same.



hearts and Flowers,



most of the support of Clinton from PoC stems from a combination of nostalgia for better times and a simple disbelief that Obama can win in November.

She said that they remember that times were good for them when billy was in office...


::



Be interesting if there was more discussion about what percentage of Hillary's primary votes are votes for Bill.



Could you imagine if an exit poll asked this question directly, especially in states like Ohio and Pennsylvania?

I'd like to know why Hillary still has support from some Blacks and Latinos and women? Not from party insiders and people who benefit from supporting her, but the average voter. And why does the corporate media seek to lump all Latinos together as a monolithic group? That first anonymous poster didn't really offer anything constructive but I am curious if it's just brand name loyalty, self-hatred, misinformation or other?

Teacher-


You know, I grew up in the Bronx. I do not have the greatest opinion of Hispanics when it comes to their relationships with blacks. All this cover, all these excuses as to why they vote for the Clintons, the truth is is that latinos (in general) whether they are from Puerto Rico, DR, Mexico, Columbia, Honduras, Guatemala, Cuba or Venezuela...they have a yes I will go as far as saying, racism. I have friends from all countries and they have all recently admitted that their family members are not voting for Obama because he doesn't look like a president, he's black etc... Many of the younger ones are open to it however a smaller percentage of the older ones.



When I was canvassing with Latinos con Obama, they were saying the same things. It did not suprise me because I was well aware of the prejudice that I received from Latinos in NY (from all countries). It's sad that they cannot put that aside. That has been in the back of my mind. They are a growing population that can turn this election in November. I hope that they will support him if he is the nominee.

"I wish O wouldv'e gone to Kentucky"


There was the Louisville rally that had about 8,000 attendees on Monday the 12th.

I am still waiting to understand why they have a primary when they don't vote in November. I think a lot of it is just familiarity with the Clintons as opposed to some black guy from Illinois.


Im sure those who are more familiar with him are supporting him.



It is all pretty much anti climatic, though....shows over, folks.

OK, I got fooled (sigh). I'm not quite ready to apply for the position of village idiot, but....I asked a Puerto Rican co-worker why Puerto Ricans are more for hillbilly & less for Obama. She said that they remember that times were good for them when billy was in office, that they know them & don't know Obama, and something else that I don't remember. Most people who are members of Afro-hispanic culture identify more with the Hispanic than with the Afro. I love PR and want to think that they are open minded to Obama. Does anyone have any information about his campaign there?


I wish O wouldv'e gone to Kentucky.

Some Reasons why a Shotgun wedding won't be necessary. (No joint ticket)


http://ruralvotes.com/thefield/?p=1220

Play around with the interactive Map


Interactive Electoral College Map

To self-loathing Anon:


I am saddened by your response but I will tell you this- there are some Blacks that support Obama over Clinton because they want to see someone in office that manifests their drea,... just as there are some Clinton supports who have a similar dream.



That said, to assume that ALL Black people support Clinton for the reason you allude to as well as the white media is basically saying Black people can not and do no think for themselves. Yes, there are some people who look at you and say- why would you forsake us this dream and still others who will accuse you waning more for whites than of your own people.



Remember it is fully acknowledged that 90% of their policies and beliefs are the same. As a person of color, I am supporting Obama because I want a CHANGE in the kind of leadership style we have reflected in government.



I have a brain, I've decided not to vote with my vagina but with my heart. To assume it's only because of race is to perpetuate the ignorance of Pat Buchanan and his boys.

I almost took the bait of this Hillz operative..


please don't hate me folks.



GTFOH FOR REAL...



Oh, and you can take the fine folks over at Hip Hop republican with you to

Anonymous, when the camapigning first started, I was excited about (KKK)clinton and thought she would be my candidate of choice. As time progressed they showed me a total lack of ethical standards. They showed me that they were willing to insult my entire race for political expediency. As adults, most people realize that there is a line in relationships that ought not be crossed. Once someoneone says the thing that cannot be unsaid, dynamics change forever. The KKKlintons went there, as far as I'm concerned. They were willing to sacrifice their good standing with my entire race to garner a few votes from racists instead of standing for something more noble and rightous. Additionally, as Lawrence O'Donnell recently said on MSNBC, HRC IS NOT VETTED as a candidate. She is involved in a lawsuit with a man named Peter Paul involving campaign fraud.I'm not sure why the MSM refuses to cover it. They (the KKKlintons) refuse to release the donor list of billy's library. I'm sure it would be a bombshell if not the actual bomb. She continuously gets caught in lies. billy has accepted $ from Columbia and China, and probably other countries that we don't know about. Do you think he could convince hill to enact policies that favor the other countries over ours? I do. She has also promoted a political opponent over a member of her own party. She has shown a willingness to injure/destroy the party or anything that stands in the path of her victory. She would pimp anyone to get what she wants! She has shown a willingness to cheat to win. She signed a document saying she would NOT campaign in the 2 states that broke party rules, and then proceeded to break her agreement. HER WORD DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING!!! Yet, she wants to hold herself up as a role model for young people, especially females, and all americans. Her philosophy is "do whatever it takes to get what you want." It is the same philosophy shared by drug dealers, pedophiles and all the bottom dwellers of our society. If that's not enough, her management of her campaign has been deplorable. She is 21 (known) million dollars in debt. Small vendors have had to publicly humiliate her just to get paid. Her own staff has has to wait for their paychecks & insurance payments to be made late. I'm not sure why you would want this (lying, cheating, racist, scandalous, non-bill paying, disorganized, non-managerial, disloyal, pimp of a) person in charge of our nation, but you are entitled to vote for whomever you want. I'm just very thankful that the majority citizens are smarter than we seem. Obama is our only hope to turn things around during this current cycle. And the mess he is going to inherit will be mind boggling, needless to say.


As for Ivy league Blacks, people are people. You will find some who are good or bad, smart or dumb, proud or humble, honest or deceptive, etc. You don't need to be overly impressed or overly intimidated by them. Just be yourself and develop yourself to a level that gives you confidence. They worked hard for those degrees. The only people who get unearned degrees are rich white people.

Good luck to you, Anonymous. I am interested in reading your defense of HRC, why she is your candidate, & why Obama isn't, if you ever feel like sharing.

Black folk are gonna take care of the Clinton Negroes.


Like a Tutsi that voted for a Hutu. ;)

rikyrah said...


i.e., be careful on who you step on climbing the ladder; they'll be there when you fall.



::



i.e., chickens will come home to roost.

Rikyrah - lololololololol see . . . I wasn't going there.
lololol







PRE -racebaiting, I just shrugged my shoulders.



POST-racebaiting, you are suspect Uncle Ruckus'.



PERIOD.

She RACEBAITS a Black Candidate for President of the United States from one end of this country to the other, and you say NOTHING?





Black folk are gonna take care of the Clinton Negroes.



Not a threat...just a statement of fact.

As Clinton chances wane, old slights come due:
Some prominent Democrats recall past grievances



i.e., be careful on who you step on climbing the ladder; they'll be there when you fall.

@ inkognegro


LOL



Here's my position on Black Hillpatine Supporters...



PRE -racebaiting, I just shrugged my shoulders.



POST-racebaiting, you are suspect Uncle Ruckus'.



PERIOD.



She RACEBAITS a Black Candidate for President of the United States from one end of this country to the other, and you say NOTHING?



GTFOH.



Black folk are gonna take care of the Clinton Negroes.



Not a threat...just a statement of fact.

Hey Another anonymous - don't fall for the hype. Just reading the original note and the follow up response you know what he/she is trying to stir up. I would blow it off and talk about something else.


Don't let him/her get to you.

FROM Another Anonymous:


Follow blindly???



Why don't you enlighten us about why Billary is the greater choice?



All I got to tell you about Bush's comments are 2 words: Prescott Bush. Do some research and get back to us!



"get crushed...." Dude, I'm just crushed by your lack of intellect.

about those tennis shoes. they really look great.

All of these negative, personal attacks merely prove my point - any one who does not stay with the flock of sheep gets shot. As a lifelong Democrat, never having voted Republican ever, I can't believe I am writing this, but maybe Bush was right about his comments regarding Nazi Germany. Follow blindly or get crushed.

Hi All - I saw a commercial in the Maryland area advertising the new Obama Yes We Can and Change We Can Believe in Air Force One's tennis shoes. They are made by a 24 year old artist named Van20


Here is the link to the artist's site. Thought I would share. Scroll down to until you get to the Obama shoes. I loved it and intend to order a few pairs. Thought I would help this artist by sharing the link and asking you to do the same if you like what he has to offer. http://www.myspace.com/van20</br>

Videos:


McCain's YouTube Problem Just Became a Nightmare



^Digg it!



Why Won't McCain Sign the GI Bill?

I responded to this earlier and not sure what happened to my post so here I go again.


Anonymous said "As a black man secretly supporting Hilary Clinton" as this is some HUGE secret like "As a black man secretly on the downlow" . . . . This alone makes me believe Anonymous isn't who he says he is.



Anonymous - I am not falling for the "elitist" label you are attempting to tag to Obama. As a matter of fact he is just the opposite and believes in empowering the people to take back their government. He is pushing people to become involved in the process not only when electing their leadership and staying involved to make sure it works for them. He provides the tools and training to make this happen.



As an aside Blacks do not hate blacks that support the Clinton vs. Obama we just don't understand how people (especially minorities) can find the blatant divisive comments and actions from the Clinton's and their campaigns acceptable. If you are able to look past the proven negative baggage from the Clintons and look past the most recent mismanagement of her campaign (i.e. finances and oversight) then more power to you. Not sure what you expect to get blogging on this topic but if you need absolution I suppose you better served by visiting your local priest.

By the way, that last "Anonymous" post was not from the originator of this thread, but from someone else responding to the initial post.

"I support her positions and feel that she would be a better president"


So I guess, IYHO, voting for the Iraq disaster without even reading the NIE indicates great presidential leadership! Last time I checked, there has not been a bigger leadership check in recent memory and SHE FAILED IT BASED ON HER OWN POLITICAL AMBITIONS!!



Over 4000 US dead, thousands more injured, millions of Iraqis that did nothing to the US displaced and thousands dead........



SHE VOTED FOR ALL OF THIS TO HAPPEN!



Yet, you feel she will be the better president.



A mind is a terrible thing to waste.

@ inkognegro


LMFAO!!!

anonymous,


you are neither black nor a Hillary supporter and this is a pathetic attempt at psy-ops. The awkward use of "folks" is to appear...well, folksy and one of the group.



You paint a picture of a tortured black man, hiding his secret support for the white candidate, while appealing to the conscience of blacks not to judge you, thereby vindicating yourself when the inevitable judgment comes.



Then, you insert a poorly veiled insult by marrying "elitist" to "Ivy League" and relating them to blacks. The supposition here, is that there are only two positions a black person can occupy: POOR/UNDEDUCATED or IVY LEAGUE/UPPITY.



Deep down, you really believe black people are gullible and highly suggestible. You are wrong on all counts.



Buzz off.

I got a cinnamon bagel that says Anonymous is actually white.


referring to black folk in the third person?





Color me skeptical.

" I have worked with and been around many elitist ivy league blacks like Obama, and I know that my personal experiences have colored my opinion.
-----------------------------------

So the race-baiting, vote white that Hillary peddled didn't mean anything b/c she was just playing,huh? (Major eye roll)

"I have worked with and been around many elitist ivy league blacks like Obama..."


::



As opposed to elitist ivy league whites like the Clintons?

As a black man secretly supporting Hilary Clinton, because I support her positions and feel that she would be a better president, please don't hate me folks. I have worked with and been around many elitist ivy league blacks like Obama, and I know that my personal experiences have colored my opinion. Why do black people hate those that do not share their opinions? I keep my support a secret because I know that not supporting Obama will label me a traitor, oreo, uncle tom or something along those lines. It is a true shame that in 2008, folks have to keep their true feelings inside to avoid criticims and ostracism.